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JF
USA
2304 Posts |
 Posted - June 02 2012 : 19:31:37
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Go to www.score-this.com and check out the two race results from today. Both had a big number of finishers, in fact the Hamburg race had over 600, but overall, the quality of times simply was not there.
I love the fact that we have more participation than ever before in today's races---not only is it good for the sport, it will save the sport. But, when yours truly runs 19:10 and gets 8th overall.....
That's a good time for me right now, but that should be a top 50 times, maybe a top 35, not a top 10.
That's the only point I'm trying to make here. The winning time was pretty good (16:21), but after that, a major drop off.
I see talent at these races, I believe that there were many runners who could run faster if they did two things. One, train more, and two, race more. But, they may be happy with where they're at and that's fine, too.
XXIV |
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DMRuns85
USA
510 Posts |
Posted - June 03 2012 : 06:01:21
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Man, American's are so slow now adays:
5000 Metres - Men
Pts
1 Farah , Mohamed GBR 12:56.98 4
2 Koech , Isiah Kiplangat KEN 12:57.63 2
3 Rupp , Galen USA 12:58.90 1
What's that now, four active Americans that have broken 13 in the 5k the last three years, five if you want to count Lagat. How many were doing this in the 80s?
I know this ain't local road racing, but still pretty sweet.
Got endorphins? |
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JF
USA
2304 Posts |
Posted - June 03 2012 : 10:21:29
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quote:
I know this ain't local road racing, but still pretty sweet.
Correct.....it's apples and oranges.....local results only.
XXIV |
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mjthiel
3 Posts |
Posted - June 03 2012 : 15:40:45
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The question is where are the fast runners?
Just by a quick look at race results from Turkey Trots and Shamrock Runs of the 80s, it’s clear those guys could run. Now I will not pretend to know what that era was like, I wasn’t even a thought yet. But I have to imagine something was drawing these guys to the line of the local road races. Whatever it was that kept these guys in the area or brought them out to buffalo provided a very exciting time (so I’ve heard).
There is no denying that the guys who toed the line back then were some of the best athletes, toughest runners, and baddest dudes you could find. But I do think it would be an insult to the current young guns of the sport to assume “they don’t make ‘em like that anymore.”
Now The Legend said it best, referring to the 80s in particular, “It was a different time.” I cannot argue that, I was not there. I have, however, had the pleasure of meeting and running with some current guys from the area who I believe could have rubbed elbows with some of those “bad dudes” had they been born a couple decades earlier. So “Where are the fast runners?” Well you just have to know where to look.
Many of the guys from the area who are flirting with national caliber marks aren’t the same people who are showing up to the local 5ks. Many of them, who were once born, rasied, or migrated to our area have followed their dreams elsewhere, places like Flagstaff, Alamosa, Florida come to mind. So obviously with our best guys off to greener pastures races won’t be as competitive.
And for some of the guys who are still in the area working and studying it seems like local road races aren’t their number one priority. A story comes to mind of a great from Northwest PA, apparently on the weekends he’d look up a road race with some prize money and head out to run it. Now I’m sure it was a little more calculated than heading down the east coast on a whim, but still I’d guess national caliber athletes were running the roads more often than they are now. So that could be why most local races do not have the depth and fast times they once did.
I am not in any way trying to argue that the talent in buffalo now is anywhere close to where it was during the late 80s and early 90s, it was a special time and I don’t think it could be recreated. My point is there are many young athletes from this area who can run with the best of them, these “fast runners” just aren’t the ones toeing the line for the local 5ks.
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DMRuns85
USA
510 Posts |
Posted - June 03 2012 : 16:27:24
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Exactly.
Got endorphins? |
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Bob K.
USA
535 Posts |
Posted - June 03 2012 : 21:06:18
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| True. There are great runners out there. Many of them just don't come out often. Dennis Pollow for instance. Turkey Trot, Subaru, where else do you see him? |
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Boyce
USA
105 Posts |
Posted - June 03 2012 : 22:13:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Bob K.
True. There are great runners out there. Many of them just don't come out often. Dennis Pollow for instance. Turkey Trot, Subaru, where else do you see him?
When dennis was living on the east coast he would only come out for the bigger/well known competitive races like bob pointed out Turkey, Subaru, he also came to the rochester area for Bergen 5k and won the Rochester St. Patricks day twice (2011 and this year) he also finished 2nd and 3rd at Lilac 10k in 2010 and 2011.
JF, if you really want to know where the fast runners are do something about it I did :) (I wonder before now I know where they will be)
http://buffalorunners.com/results/2011/Bergen11.htm |
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JF
USA
2304 Posts |
Posted - June 04 2012 : 03:14:53
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Dennis Pollow doesn't live in WNY anymore.....
Bergen is one race with prize money.
XXIV |
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Npage148
84 Posts |
Posted - June 04 2012 : 09:37:51
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I think the biggest issue is a dilution of talent via 6+ 5ks each weekend. I don't expect to see 10+ runners at each race running sub 17 when there that many races. A fast runner goes to these races and is alone in front by 30 seconds after the first mile. Why not shut it down and cruise in for the 60 second win (as opposed to the 90 second win)? The big races (w and w/o money) draw fast times that are not that much different from the good old days.
I like this dilution, it means I may have a chance to win a 5k with a pedestrian 18 min run |
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plpjap
USA
46 Posts |
Posted - June 04 2012 : 19:03:36
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| As one of the "old farts" from the 70's, there may have been faster overall winning times due to fewer races. However, I would say that there are vastly more faster runners (men and women) today in their 40's, 50's, and especially 60's and 70's than back then. I would love to see just one "age graded" race in the area....now that would put a whole different light on the "winning" time. |
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DMRuns85
USA
510 Posts |
Posted - June 05 2012 : 09:26:55
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This is what the fast runners from the WNY do, run big races:
Rock ‘n’ Roll San Diego – Marathon Results
June 3, 2012
OvrPl Bib Name City, State Time
1 6 Nixon Machichim , 02:10:03
2 9 Desta Gebrehiwot , 02:10:13
3 13 Tesfaye Sendeku , 02:11:17
4 8 Weldon Kirui , 02:11:28
5 2 Patrick Ivuti , 02:11:39
6 15 Guor Marial Flagstaff, AZ 02:12:55
7 11 Gashaw Melese , 02:12:56
8 12 Jeffrey Eggleston Flagstaff, AZ 02:13:13
Got endorphins? |
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Boyce
USA
105 Posts |
Posted - June 05 2012 : 11:00:53
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quote:
Originally posted by JF
Dennis Pollow doesn't live in WNY anymore.....
Bergen is one race with prize money.
XXIV
"Dennis Pollow doesnt live in wny anymore...."
Is that a statement or a question???
"Bergen is one race with prize money"
Thats not the only reason why it gets a good field. I know races in western and central ny that has more prize money and if you check the results you never know they had prize money.
Heres the top 10 of this race it paided top 10 for men and women. 1st place for M/F - $500.
1 Nicholas Roertgen M 21 0:17:17
2 Stephen Paddock M 17 0:18:50
3 Jen Taft F 25 0:19:29
4 Samantha Sauer F 16 0:19:36
5 Vincent Maritim M 25 0:19:49
6 Daniel Kingsley M 34 0:19:59
7 Chase Breed M 14 0:20:05
8 Noah Sims M 14 0:20:15
9 Tessa Devereaux F 17 0:20:17
10 Ryan Misencik M 37 0:20:29
Where are the fast runners you asked??? Like a bunch of ppl said the fast runners are smart and arent racing every local race, there are to many local little races now, and i think most race directors out there are more concerned on raising or making money for there cause or businness than putting together a good field.
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lkizz
USA
945 Posts |
Posted - June 05 2012 : 13:56:51
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who ever is keeping the master list of "why the runners of yore were faster"
please add:
8. Current runners are only in it for the money.
Thanks |
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Jan J.
USA
262 Posts |
Posted - June 05 2012 : 14:23:02
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@lkizz:
Such cynicism, from one so young....
Jan J. |
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lkizz
USA
945 Posts |
Posted - June 05 2012 : 15:03:17
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I think it is a legitimate contributing factor. Who can afford to bust their arse for free these days, unless of course you are living off the fat of entitlement from a by gone manufacturing era.
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist" ~ G Carlin
"A man should look for what is, and not for what he thinks should be" ~A Einstein (retort to G Carlin) |
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Jan J.
USA
262 Posts |
Posted - June 05 2012 : 18:51:21
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@lkizz
Perhaps only someone currently parked in the heady, privileged and premier perch of 'disinformation technology' is in a far better position to comment pertinently on those poor souls now living off of the pathetically petrified sweat of their long suffering brows. So be it.
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed IT guy" ~ L Kitzmiller
"An IT guy should look for what is, and not for what he thinks should be" ~Jan J (retort to L Kitzmiller)
Jan J
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Where are the fast runners??
